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So what is the next step for Vlad ?

Joseph Cosgrove

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Let's be serious for a moment shall we? When he has taken the Ukraine*, then what?
He's got most of the world against him. The sanctions which are in place, are at best long term sanctions, which will hurt his people more than him.
He wouldn't dare attack a NATO country.
Does he think that he can just brush attacking another sovereign state under the carpet?
My question is, then what ?

*Even though the Ukrainians won't go down without a fight. And the US are thinking about giving them Poland's MIGs in exchange for F16s.
 
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Let's be serious for a moment shall we? When he has taken the Ukraine*, then what?
He's got most of the world against him. The sanctions which are in place, are at best long term sanctions, which will hurt his people more than him.
He wouldn't dare attack a NATO country.
Does he think that he can just brush attacking another sovereign state under the carpet?
My question is, then what ?

*Even though the Ukrainians won't go down without a fight. And the US are thinking about giving them Poland's MIGs in exchange for F16s.
What about the creeping expansion of NATO around Russia? Russia & NATO had talks about this in the 90s. Not taking sides but putin does not want NATO missiles in his back door.
 
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Again not taking sides here but two sides to this story. Thinking putin will invade central Europe is just mass hysteria caused by the media.
 

rashisan

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Hello guys,

there is another story, Ukrainian war is just a diversion, maybe we need to look at Chinese region, US have their plan and maybe there will be the main battle. Why AUKUS was made? So while Russia is in war with Ukraine they will not start war in their east flank. We know what happened on WW2 with Germany.

We cannot see the biggest picture...yet.
 
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Putin is unhinged and ruthless. Certainly he has his eye on the Baltic states.
He has verbally threatened Finland and Sweden who are not members of NATO.

I believe a covert opt on the dark side with a massive pecuniary inducement should
be made to his hit teams of Wagner and Chechen assassins to kill their lord and
paymaster with a guaranteed anonymity. I am sure that one or more are venal enough
to be turned

Any organization or country doing so would of course deny any association or responsibility.
 

Kronenberg

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There are many partial answers to Joe's original question.

1) Rumours abound going back to 2020 that Putin is terminally ill with cancer. His recent "strangely fat face" may be a result of steroids used in cancer treatment. If this is true, and given his fixation on the "Ukraine Problem" (that he recently wrote a book about), many believe he wants to leave a legacy for Russia before he dies by bringing it back into the fold.

2) Reports suggest that over the last 2 years Putin completely isolated himself and spoke to very few people, including his top advisors. If the cancer story is true, and he hid away because of his reduced ability to fight Covid due to that illness, he probably used that time to plan this invasion. His 10m meeting table also adds some weight to the low autoimmune theory. In short, he has limited time in front of him.

3) From the very outset Putin threatened nukes, presumably to avoid any drawn out conventional conflict with the West. Nobody in their right mind was going to call his bluff on that, so he almost certainly believed that walking into Ukraine was going to be a pushover with little or no resistance given the West's inability to assist. It should have been a 5 day war at worst given the overwhelming odds in his favour.

4) In the press conferences Putin has televised to date with his Generals, they appear to be far less convinced about the Ukraine operation that he is. They are clearly being ruled and told what to do and say with an iron rod and they didn't appear happy about that. Its therefore unlikely that either Russia's military or Russia's population would have any appetite for attacking other countries once the Ukraine issue is resolved (one way or another).

5) As we know, overwhelming a country with military force is considerably easier than governing that country once the shooting stops. In the case of Ukraine, the country is so "westernised" that insurgencies would continue for decades to come and Putin would need tens of thousands of agents on the ground to accomplish order in a population of 15m. A shortcut for establishing direct or indirect rule would be to have Kiev governed by Belarus and its military that are just a few Kms away compared to Moscow. Perhaps that's why Belarus is playing such a major role in the conflict.

5) It's always possible that Putin has simply "gone mad" and is holding the world to ransom with his nukes in order to get his own way with the least amount of resistance possible. That strategy is clearly working for the moment. It's a short game however, and if he is going to die soon anyway why should he care about nukes? The best that can happen for him is that Ukrainian resistance crumbles and the West just roll over and pretend life goes on as normal. The worst that can happen is that he loses the conflict and the sanctions bite so deep for his population that he is publicly humiliated. It's at that moment the world should hold its breath.

In any event I don't believe Putin's ambitions stretch any further than Ukraine, and I don't think the Russian military or the Russian population have any appetite whatsoever for major conflict. Ukraine is a personal grievance for Putin that he is hell bent on winning, and he has captured the world as pawns in his game.
 
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Let's be serious for a moment shall we? When he has taken the Ukraine*, then what?
He's got most of the world against him. The sanctions which are in place, are at best long term sanctions, which will hurt his people more than him.
He wouldn't dare attack a NATO country.
Does he think that he can just brush attacking another sovereign state under the carpet?
My question is, then what ?

*Even though the Ukrainians won't go down without a fight. And the US are thinking about giving them Poland's MIGs in exchange for F16s.
I think the “then what?” depends on what we don’t know yet.
So much is hidden. These are things that will come out in maybe 100 years.
Serious politicians and heads of states (if there are any) will have to pick up the pieces to the best of their abilities and knowledge.

Even if we don’t go into a real out and out WW3, many of the same resulting situations will exist. Whatever happens, we will be in an afterwar.
There will be a serious shift in what country is or is not a Super Power.
Some countries might no longer be as we know them.
For sure people worldwide will be more difficult to control because the need to resist will have become stronger than ever before.
Many of the things we take for granted today will have changed
 
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The resistence seems to be getting stronger everyday. Putin didn't expect that.
But, my question is: What is going to happen with Russia/Putin? Will them make all that mess and go away without a punishment?
 
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I did answer your question indirectly. He just wants the Ukraine under Russian control and not nato. Is that hard to understand?
That's debatable. I think sooner or later he would attempt to take over the three baltic states, which of course are NATO allies. That would be the line for me. The rubble is already worth as much as a penny (or less) so insight of nothing else to loose he would surely make a move? He's Basically a cornered dog at this point
 

voltigeur

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I believe that was Putin's aim right from the beginning, He has/had visions of a one great Russia without satellite states like the former USSR.
 

Joseph Cosgrove

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I think that you can deduct one from the Ukrainian total, as I saw one on the news (France 2 20h) who deserted from the REP, he was completely covered, including dark sunglasses.
 
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Once in another incarnation I was called ruthless.

Now Putin's mistress Allina Kabaeva aged 38 and former Gold Medal winner has 2 young sons and
twin daughters, aged seven who were born near Lugano. All have Swiss nationality and they are holed up
in a very secure and private chalet.

I would hold them in what might be euphemistically called 'protective custody' until such time that he saw
common sense.

He of course is 69 and has two daughters Maria 36 and Katerina 35 from his first marriage to Lyudmila
Shkrebneva, his wife of 3O years, a former air stewardess.

He will only recognize single minded ruthlessness and pressure on his young family might possibly bear
fruit.
 

Perun

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Let's be serious for a moment shall we? When he has taken the Ukraine*, then what?
He's got most of the world against him. The sanctions which are in place, are at best long term sanctions, which will hurt his people more than him.
He wouldn't dare attack a NATO country.
Does he think that he can just brush attacking another sovereign state under the carpet?
My question is, then what ?

*Even though the Ukrainians won't go down without a fight. And the US are thinking about giving them Poland's MIGs in exchange for F16s.
It all depends how "smooth" things go. Seeing how things are not going smoothly, I wonder and fear will he ignite what ever he can - where ever he can. Having my neighbourhood in mind.
Like I posted earlier somewhere, my eyes are on Kosovo, Montenegro and BiH.
He has friends here, friends (with political agenda) whose only hope is him.
 

kkillert0fu

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The thing is, at this point, Putin's fate is very grim no matter what. Whether it's because of consequences from the international community, or even consequences from within Russia once their economy tanks. It's not like he can recall his military, tell the world he was just kidding, and everybody will forget about it and go back to the way things were a few weeks ago. Maybe, just maybe, there might have been some way to de-escalate this in the first few days, and while it would have certainly had its consequences, it's possible that it could have largely mitigated any disastrous outcome. But once those first few days passed, it was clear that Putin was doubling down. And has been doing so ever since. And in doing that, he has completely backed himself into a corner and put himself in a position from which there is no escape. I think it is likely he will do something very drastic in the foreseeable future, just looking at how far he has already come with it. Right now, he may very well believe he can come out of this on top and face little to no repercussions for it. Maybe the rumors about his health are true. But at some point he's going to start feeling things closing in on him, and that could very well be catastrophic.
 

Kronenberg

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And in doing that, he has completely backed himself into a corner and put himself in a position from which there is no escape. I think it is likely he will do something very drastic in the foreseeable future, just looking at how far he has already come with it. Right now, he may very well believe he can come out of this on top and face little to no repercussions for it. Maybe the rumors about his health are true. But at some point he's going to start feeling things closing in on him, and that could very well be catastrophic.
A corner maybe, but perhaps that corner has a secret door. Putin is way too shrewd to leave himself exposed like that (unless the lack of progress in Ukraine is really a huge shock for him).
Other despots - China, N Korea and Iran would certainly help him out of that corner I suspect even if he was humiliated in this conflict. Firing off nukes would not just affect the West - it would also affect them.
 
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