Catholic Church in World War II

Cernunnos

Active Member
Pro Member
#21
You have no cooking clue about history mate...Romans not a democracy???Have you not heard of the republic or Senate? Funny you mention that savages stay as tribes, the Celts and the Britons were drinking each other's blood and living in Mud huts before the Romans arrived, however the Romans brought roads and castles/forts. The Briton tribes were the ultimate savages? Do you think they still are considering savages and have stayed a tribe?

And who gave the Monarch's God's grace was it not the Pope? What started the English reformation? Was it not Henry Tudor that refused to follow the Pope's instruction. Read up on your own history before making claims.

Ask Galileo, about not condemning scientists....

Further more I'll repeat my previous statement about them being anti democracy, read up how the Catholic Church decreed the magna carta herecy, and the Pope proactively supported Monarchies over any democratic government.

Additionally there's a reason that their time of greatest influence is called the dark ages, thank goodness we had the Renaissance and reformation to propel our civilization forward...
If you weren't talking out of your arse you'd know that Rome was a republic, which is different to a Democracy.
Was "Funny you mention that savages stay as tribes, the Celts and the Britons were drinking each other's blood and living in Mud huts before the Romans arrived, however the Romans brought roads and castles/forts." meant to prove me wrong because all it did was prove my point.
What does "The Briton tribes were the ultimate savages? Do you think they still are considering savages and have stayed a tribe?" even mean?
Yes, the Briton tribes were savages and they were tribal until the Romans brought civilisation to them.

"who gave the Monarch's God's grace was it not the Pope?" You said the Pope "manipulated" Monarchs but now you agree that the Monarchs legitimacy stems from the Pope?
Because I don't know how to interpret that any other way.
What started the English Reformation? Heresy.
"Read up on your own history before making claims." I know my history, thank you.
I have the Oxford Companion to British History right here, feel free to borrow it anytime.

About Galileo, https://www.catholic.com/tract/the-galileo-controversy , go to Clinging to Tradition?.

You seem to think being anti-Democracy is a bad thing.
The Romans weren't Democratic and many great civilisations weren't.
Because Democracy isn't the ultimate form of government and is deeply flawed.

"there's a reason that their time of greatest influence is called the dark ages"
"The Dark Ages is a term often used synonymously with the Middle Ages. It refers to the period of time between the fall of the Roman Empire and the beginning of the Italian Renaissance and the Age of Discovery. Many textbooks list the Dark Ages as extending from 500-1500 AD, although it should be noted these are approximations.

The term 'Dark Ages' was coined by an Italian scholar named Francesco Petrarch. Petrarch, who lived from 1304 to 1374, used this label to describe what he perceived as a lack of quality in the Latin literature of his day. Other thinkers came along and expanded this designation to include not only literature, but also culture in general. The term thus evolved as a designation for the supposed lack of culture and advancement in Europe during the medieval period.

The term generally has a negative connotation. Debate continues to rage among historians over whether the Middle Ages were, indeed, dark or not. Increasingly, many scholars are questioning whether the term Dark Ages is an accurate description or not."

This is a transcript from a lesson held by Prof. Nate Sullivan (who holds a M.A. in History and a M.Ed. He is an adjunct history professor and former middle school history teacher).
 

dusaboss

Hyper Active Member
#23
I'm not Catholic so I wasn't born into it nor have I chosen to follow it.
You speaking really passionately for non-Catholic and your nickname is Celtic pagan god closely matching Christian Satan. Damn, you are contradictory boy. :)


Yes, before Catholicism Human sacrifice was extremely common.
I think you should use term "Christianity". Split occurred only 1054 (and some others letter). Catholicism is therm used to describe only Roman Catholic Church.

Yes in S. America human sacrifice was practiced at the time good "Catholics" came. That was not such common practice, but yes it was happening. Our good Catholics put end on that savage custom. Killing them almost all in proces, but they don't do that savagery anymore.! :)

If you believe in absolute morality then you should know that it isn't created, it just is.
You don't need "believe" in moral in order to have it. Moral is product of evolution not invention of church and religion.
 

SnafuSmite

Active Member
#24
If you weren't talking out of your arse you'd know that Rome was a republic, which is different to a Democracy.
Was "Funny you mention that savages stay as tribes, the Celts and the Britons were drinking each other's blood and living in Mud huts before the Romans arrived, however the Romans brought roads and castles/forts." meant to prove me wrong because all it did was prove my point.
What does "The Briton tribes were the ultimate savages? Do you think they still are considering savages and have stayed a tribe?" even mean?
Yes, the Briton tribes were savages and they were tribal until the Romans brought civilisation to them.

"who gave the Monarch's God's grace was it not the Pope?" You said the Pope "manipulated" Monarchs but now you agree that the Monarchs legitimacy stems from the Pope?
Because I don't know how to interpret that any other way.
What started the English Reformation? Heresy.
"Read up on your own history before making claims." I know my history, thank you.
I have the Oxford Companion to British History right here, feel free to borrow it anytime.

About Galileo, https://www.catholic.com/tract/the-galileo-controversy , go to Clinging to Tradition?.

You seem to think being anti-Democracy is a bad thing.
The Romans weren't Democratic and many great civilisations weren't.
Because Democracy isn't the ultimate form of government and is deeply flawed.

"there's a reason that their time of greatest influence is called the dark ages"
"The Dark Ages is a term often used synonymously with the Middle Ages. It refers to the period of time between the fall of the Roman Empire and the beginning of the Italian Renaissance and the Age of Discovery. Many textbooks list the Dark Ages as extending from 500-1500 AD, although it should be noted these are approximations.

The term 'Dark Ages' was coined by an Italian scholar named Francesco Petrarch. Petrarch, who lived from 1304 to 1374, used this label to describe what he perceived as a lack of quality in the Latin literature of his day. Other thinkers came along and expanded this designation to include not only literature, but also culture in general. The term thus evolved as a designation for the supposed lack of culture and advancement in Europe during the medieval period.

The term generally has a negative connotation. Debate continues to rage among historians over whether the Middle Ages were, indeed, dark or not. Increasingly, many scholars are questioning whether the term Dark Ages is an accurate description or not."

This is a transcript from a lesson held by Prof. Nate Sullivan (who holds a M.A. in History and a M.Ed. He is an adjunct history professor and former middle school history teacher).
As much as I hate Wikipedia, I will borrow their quote.
A republic (Latin: res publica) is a form of government in which the country is considered a "public matter", not the private concern or property of the rulers. The primary positions of power within a republic are not inherited, but are attained through elections expressing the consent of the governed. Such leadership positions are therefore expected to fairly represent the citizen body. It is a form of government under which the head of state is not a monarch.

I concur dark ages, is perhaps the wrong term as it was only coined after the fact, but you cannot deny that it was a cultural black hole in our history that was greatly spurred on by the church.

If you read my post correctly I mention Rome being a Republic so before talking out your own arse, id assume you'd read the text correctly and cite it as you seem to enjoy doing.

I cant believe you keep using Catholic Literature to support your argument, I repeat of course they wouldnt shine themselves in a bad light, it's like viewing the perspective of the accused and using their testimony for justification. If you can find me a source that is non biased and doesnt include Catholic in their URL I'd probably be more likely to accept it as non biased fact, not a one sided story.

On a final note, do you really believe that if you have the command of the most powerful men in their respective countries as well as their payments to you out of their coffers that you wont manipulate things to suit your own agenda. The pope isnt a god he is a man and any man witg that amount of power will sway things in his own favor.
 

dusaboss

Hyper Active Member
#26
The pope isnt a god he is a man and any man witg that amount of power will sway things in his own favor.
Ooh don't say that. God said that they would speak in his name. They are good, some of best man on planet! They also like children, I mean really like them. ;)
 

Joseph Cosgrove

Moderator
Legionnaire
#28
I went through basic in the Brit army with a bunch of Jocks -Prods to be exact. And then in 3 REI with a bunch of N. Irish and Eire, again Prods, with 1 Taeg (not sure how it's spelt) a catholic. Luckily he was protected by a guy called Stevie Mullans _ I like to mention names because if anyone knows him,it gives credibility to the story.
The teag was called McCullen and was the smallest weakest guy around. Stevie was ex-Brit Army Medic corps and big and a boxer.

Ok rambling a bit here, I'll tell you a funny story about the two of them - tomorrow if I remember.
In the foyer of 3eme Reich, the “Anglais de merdeâ€￾ as we were called, would push the tables together and whoever had money would get the beers in. The Germans did the same thing. Jackdaw (again not sure of the spelling) the taeg would always find a seat next to Stevie. Now remember he is the only Irish Catholic among all the Irish Prods...

Anyway what I wanted to say is, that is how I learned the words to the song:
BTW I was born a catholic and my father was from Eire,

[video=youtube;IS05UxBVTtY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IS05UxBVTtY[/video]

Now try and Imagine a bunch of drunken Anglais de merde on a Saturday night just after being paid.
And again being a Taeg!
 

Cernunnos

Active Member
Pro Member
#29
You speaking really passionately for non-Catholic and your nickname is Celtic pagan god closely matching Christian Satan. Damn, you are contradictory boy. :)




I think you should use term "Christianity". Split occurred only 1054 (and some others letter). Catholicism is therm used to describe only Roman Catholic Church.

Yes in S. America human sacrifice was practiced at the time good "Catholics" came. That was not such common practice, but yes it was happening. Our good Catholics put end on that savage custom. Killing them almost all in proces, but they don't do that savagery anymore.! :)



You don't need "believe" in moral in order to have it. Moral is product of evolution not invention of church and religion.
I'm just tired of everyone taking a sucker punch at Catholicism when they know little to nothing about it.
Whenever Islam is criticised everyone cracks open a history book to defend it but when it's Catholicism getting slandered then everyone either stays silent or takes part in the slander.
Also Cernunnos isn't similar to Lucifer due to the fact that Cernunnos is the Celtic god of fertility, life, animals, wealth, and the underworld.
Whereas the Lightbringer was prideful, jealous and manipulative.
The closest thing they have in common is the whole "underworld" theme but the underworld back then just meant the afterlife and the afterlife for Catholics is to be with God in the Kingdom of Heaven.
Hell is more of a prison for sinners.
Sinners being those that wilfully turn away from God and reject him entirely.
Since, even if you sin, if you are truly trying to make yourself better and live a pious life then you will be forgiven.

Funnily enough, the Aztecs got jumped on by the surrounding tribes due to how brutal they were.
Most of the blood is on the native South American's hands, not to say the Pious Conquistadors didn't help.

I was talking Absolute Morality, as in the concept of Absolute Morality vs Relative Morality.
If only evolution brings morality then why do so few animals live good lives?
I put forth the argument that morality is a by-product of intelligence, culture and faith.


As much as I hate Wikipedia, I will borrow their quote.
A republic (Latin: res publica) is a form of government in which the country is considered a "public matter", not the private concern or property of the rulers. The primary positions of power within a republic are not inherited, but are attained through elections expressing the consent of the governed. Such leadership positions are therefore expected to fairly represent the citizen body. It is a form of government under which the head of state is not a monarch.

I concur dark ages, is perhaps the wrong term as it was only coined after the fact, but you cannot deny that it was a cultural black hole in our history that was greatly spurred on by the church.

If you read my post correctly I mention Rome being a Republic so before talking out your own arse, id assume you'd read the text correctly and cite it as you seem to enjoy doing.

I cant believe you keep using Catholic Literature to support your argument, I repeat of course they wouldnt shine themselves in a bad light, it's like viewing the perspective of the accused and using their testimony for justification. If you can find me a source that is non biased and doesnt include Catholic in their URL I'd probably be more likely to accept it as non biased fact, not a one sided story.

On a final note, do you really believe that if you have the command of the most powerful men in their respective countries as well as their payments to you out of their coffers that you wont manipulate things to suit your own agenda. The pope isnt a god he is a man and any man witg that amount of power will sway things in his own favor.

No I don't agree the "dark ages" was "spurred on" by the Church, in fact the "dark ages" would have been much "darker" without the Church.
"Romans not a democracy???Have you not heard of the republic or Senate?" This is you implying that the Roman Republic was a democracy.
The whole point of those websites is to answer any criticism against the Catholic Church, why wouldn't I use them?
There is no un-biased answer here, either you're in agreement or you're not.
You're biased towards the Church or you're not.

It's not impossible for a bad person to be selected Pope, it's just very very rare.
Any Man is susceptible to sin, I never denied that.
 
#30
A couple of point, to set a few things straight...

1/ The western powers (essentially at the time, the UK and France), represented by their PMs, Mrs. Neville Chamberlain and Édouard Daladier, did do everything to avoid a war with Nazi Germany. They went as far as signing the Munich Agreement, in Sept 1938, accepting the independence of the Sudetenland on the pretext that its population was in majority German-speaking. This led to the dismantlement of Czechoslovakia, while the two powers were supposed to guarantee the borders of a country created after WW1 on the ruins of the defunct Austro-Hungarian Empire. The Red Line was Poland and when Hitler decided to invade it, France and the UK finally reluctantly resigned to declaring war on Germany.

2/ The indulgences were indeed “a way to reduce the amount of punishment a soul had to undergo for sinsâ€￾. Over time, it became a business, since the living were paying to get indulgences for their dead relatives who hadn't behave too well while on Earth. This business was one of the causes of the Reformation Schism provoked by Martin Luther in 1517 (500th anniversary this year) which led to the creation of Protestantism. This schism was coming after a number of others (including the Great Schism that saw the creation of the Orthodox Church in 1054). Anyway, all that to say that the Catholic Church isn't the only Christian Church...
 

Cernunnos

Active Member
Pro Member
#31
A couple of point, to set a few things straight...

1/ The western powers (essentially at the time, the UK and France), represented by their PMs, Mrs. Neville Chamberlain and Édouard Daladier, did do everything to avoid a war with Nazi Germany. They went as far as signing the Munich Agreement, in Sept 1938, accepting the independence of the Sudetenland on the pretext that its population was in majority German-speaking. This led to the dismantlement of Czechoslovakia, while the two powers were supposed to guarantee the borders of a country created after WW1 on the ruins of the defunct Austro-Hungarian Empire. The Red Line was Poland and when Hitler decided to invade it, France and the UK finally reluctantly resigned to declaring war on Germany.

2/ The indulgences were indeed “a way to reduce the amount of punishment a soul had to undergo for sinsâ€￾. Over time, it became a business, since the living were paying to get indulgences for their dead relatives who hadn't behave too well while on Earth. This business was one of the causes of the Reformation Schism provoked by Martin Luther in 1517 (500th anniversary this year) which led to the creation of Protestantism. This schism was coming after a number of others (including the Great Schism that saw the creation of the Orthodox Church in 1054). Anyway, all that to say that the Catholic Church isn't the only Christian Church...
Thanks Rapace, I wish I could write posts as succinctly as you. Writing too much is a bad habit I picked up during my English Literature and English Language lessons.
Yeah, Catholicism isn't the only Christian Church, but it's the best one though. [emoji14]
 

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