Who on earth would go from UKSF to The Legion????? To my Knowledge this has never happened. (Doing selection is not included) ;-)Originally Posted by Rapace
Some have started life in the FFL and gone to the Brits which lead to UKSF service..... When guys get to that level of soldiering (The Pinnacle) they tend never to return to the bullshit of Green soldiering.
Yip,
SG FLA GB is one of them.
If my understandinmg is correct GCP is as close to spec. ops. (along with a few other ffl units) as one can get. Also the Legion is an elite ligh infantry which I would say resambles something like Rangers.
Question is almost no countries (even US) give those jobs to non citizens due to security reasons, how and why do the French deal with that as foreigners can and probably are involved in missions designated secret ?
No GCP are Pathfinders and most of what they do is well known and documented. Just search YouTube and you'll see the activities/ deployments they're involved in. They are not Clandestine Special Forces Soldiers. They have a similar(ish) job to The British Parachute Regiments Pathfinders. GCP are Green Soldiers governed by The 2REP Hierarchy and are only 25 in number.
SF and Special Op's are irregular soldiers that get Special Forces Pay and it's reflected in the Hazardous nature of the work they do. Units such as The SAS (including Ozzie and NZ), SBS, Delta, Navy Seals and Green Berets are SF are paid appropriately! They Normally operate under their own jurisdiction and leadership. There are of course exceptions to this rule and now in the Brits we have an SAS Sqn that has a SFSG Bn (currently 3 Para) that works under the auspices of whatever Brigade commander is running the show. This has been changed in recent years due to UKSF being overstretched! It requires quality green soldiers to do a lot of the jobs so the SAS (in Iraq) and SB (in Afghanistan) can focus on sneaky beakey tasks!!
US Army Rangers are NOT SF or Special Ops. Neither are their 101st or 82nd Airbornes, Neither are GCP or GCM in The Legion. Sure they might get jump pay or dive pay depending on their speciality or role but they're not Special Forces.
Neither are half the units or Regiments that half you Walter Mitty's read about on the net or see on TV. I'm not saying they're not got good at what they do as they're very capable.
PS Not at all relevant to the Tattoo question asked by Nick. But since it's been asked I thought I'd offer my take which should clarify the situation.
I think you are either out of your mind or too caught up in silly nationalistic pride in your mother's regiment to make the statement that the US Rangers and the Legion's GCP are not 'Special Forces.' Their training and operational capabilities make them about as special as you can get.
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Nothing to do with Nationalistic pride Samtoo. I acknowledged both American and British units who have proved to be very capable and that are genuine Special Forces.
Many fail to understand the difference between conventional/green soldiers and those that are not. This leads to many claiming SF or special Op's status when they are in fact anything but.
This is not taking anything away from GCP or US Rangers. But I think you'll agree Delta (SFOD-D) are far more 'Special' than US Army Rangers and that 13th Parachute Dragoon Regiment are far more 'special' than GCP.
As you'll probably know both the above mentioned (13 PDR and SFOD-D) get Special Forces Pay. Neither US Army Rangers or GCP get paid as Special Forces soldiers.
Last edited by Rapace; 16th January 2009 at 08:32.
I agree with PW, GCP and US Army Rangers are NOT Special Forces. They are exceptionally fit and highly trained regular forces more akin to Pathfinders than "Blades".
I would not class 13 RDP as Special Forces either, in my experience they are an extremely competent regular army unit with elements of special forces taskings in their role.
Also in my opinion true Special Forces are (usually small) organisations like SAS or US SF (comparatively small taking into account US Army Orbat) who can multi task, primarily dealing with Recon and persecution in small groups.
There are alot of peripherals past and present who class themselves as SF. (examples being Koevoet (SA police) GSG9 (German border guards) Selous Scouts (Rhodies military)) who are highly trained, experienced and excellent small units but are experts in their field of operations.
A guy who can be drinking guinness in the Grapes one week, talking Arabic with a local Omani Sheik the next, shinning down the outside of a building in Kensington the following week, blowing up small aircraft inside a hostile country on the third week and carrying his faeces around a field in South Armagh (then usually writing a book about it all LOL) then next may quite probably be justified in considering himself SF.
And also very true as PW says once you have reached this pinacle you will have had to screw your life up spectacularly to consider the Legion as an option. Where it doesn't matter whether you are Rambo or Bilko you will start from the floor (which you will spend plenty of time scrubbing) upwards and will be a basic engage volunteer (recruit)
Is it Thursday already??? TOM was in the SAS and he had about as much sense as the Norwegian who knighted a penguin and appeared to be at the same intellectual level as the tic-tac-toe playing chicken at the State fair! Maybe your reference to "Special Forces" equals the definition as the "Special Olympics?"
The only forum member endorsed by both Jesus and Satan.
Ok... For the sake of clarity, just created a thread with the messages originally posted in the "Name tattoo question" thread open by NickFury.
Prends garde aux rapaces qui fondent du ciel
All of the above in one way or another ar "special forces". they have different missions. There is only 1 delta. So if you are talking about a group of true "rambos" it is them. You do not pick delta they pick you out of "sf" ranger, seal, ect.... At the same time since I have been on this site I have talked to people that worked with the FFL in Iraq and Vet Nam. There observation of the FFL was that there is no other like it. Both guys where VERY impressed with how well they carried out missions. So to say that the FFL is not "special forces" I would have to dissagree. Yea in the rear it may be boreing with a lot of busy work, but when the shit hits the fan there are few countries that have elite units like this that can just GET IT DONE! Also wanting to join the FFL is a personal decision. To see if you can do something bigger then yourself. Be a part of a brotherhood that few get to see. I can go to the army today and say I want to be a ranger. I will be in basic, jump school, then ranger school. When I fly to France to ask to be in the FFL they may just say no. If you could make it in any of the mentioned groups you are an elite soilder, and there are not many that would argue this. Unless through a pc not face to face.
Bullshit. You don't know what the **** you're talking about. Delta Recruit from the Army.... Navy Seals are NOT eligible for Delta and Vice versa. You are classic example of someone who has probably read far too many books and has neither been a part of (Or at least worked with SF)
The FFL are not Special Forces.
Maybe not special forces but certainly a "special Force"
Espri de corps and the ethos to complete the mission regardless of cost makes Legionnaires special. This is not to say that they parachute behind enemy lines and train local guerillas and lead them on raids vs the enemy, they do not have that operational capability (might be individuals in the legion that has though..)
Still if the General of the Legion would ask of a company to do so they would!
And that is pretty effing special!
**** it... My Old Boy Scouts unit was SF as they were special and had a special sense of camaraderie and Ethos. We were exceptionally tough as our teacher made us play British Bulldogs topless.
Naturally the skins always won...... PS I used to be a sixer.
You Dickheads!
I have no idea what Bulldgos, sixers mean?
Your witt is lost on me
Ok, my idea about the Legion is somewhere around an old school army like the Wermacht (without the nazi crap) and jail.
Still the Wermacht did score some hits on the rest of europe.
Delta recruits from U.S. Army units World-wide, twice per year. After a very extensive screening process, applicants reportedly attend a two or three week special assessment and selection course. Those who make it through the course, enter the Delta Special Operators Training Course, which is estimated to be about six weeks in duration. Delta Force is primarily comprised of hand-picked volunteers from the 82nd Airborne, Army Special Forces and Army Rangers. Delta is said to be the best in the World at close-quarters combat.
SORRY!!!!!
my bad. You are correct. Delta does not recruit directly from the seals. I was told different while in the US army. Bottom line they are the most secret soilders we have over here and unless you are doing the recruiting you can not say for sure where they come from.
Bottom line it doesnt matter who are why. Every man makes his own decision. Only he knows why he want to join one over the other. In comparison to the rest of the military all mentioned are a grade above the rest. If you want to be a carrer soilder pick your own path. How many FFL's,Delta,ect.. do people even get to meet. What if you go FFl the ranger, then seal. Would Delta not be interisted in this soilder?
Last edited by fritz28; 17th January 2009 at 00:30. Reason: and
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